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GPT-Rosalind-6 System Card Addendum (deploymentsafety.openai.com)
47 points by gmays 2026-11-02 | 39 comments | side by side | 11 rewritten | show 4 removed | updated 19:02 UTC
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deadnomore 2026-11-02 17:213/10tangential_annoyance | next [–]

The phrase system card is so frustrating because it’s using the word card like it’s a metaphor for something but then abuses it. A card is supposed to be small and concise. This has many, many pages and is an “addendum”.

The phrase system card is so frustrating because it’s using the word card like it’s a metaphor for something but then abuses it. A card is supposed to be small and concise. This has many, many pages and is an “addendum”.

A small but real point about the 'card' name not fitting a long addendum; minor, but it isn't hostile.

Slightly off-topic to this model card but has anyone noticed changes to GPT6 Astra about a week after 6.1 came out?

I feel like 6 Astra just turned a lot lazier during planning and strangely enough claude has become a lot more assertive with Opus 5.5 while it used to be very lazy.

It’s really obvious during planning, it used to be that claude would just give a best effort guess and handwave things but now it will actually write small tests, launch playwright to test a hypothetical and even look things up in github during a question. This was something codex’s models were really good at.

I’ve read so many stories about people claiming models getting nerfed after a new release and now it seems I can finally join them.

Slightly off-topic to this model card but has anyone noticed changes to GPT6 Astra about a week after 6.1 came out?

I feel like 6 Astra just turned a lot lazier during planning and strangely enough claude has become a lot more assertive with Opus 5.5 while it used to be very lazy.

It’s really obvious during planning, it used to be that claude would just give a best effort guess and handwave things but now it will actually write small tests, launch playwright to test a hypothetical and even look things up in github during a question. This was something codex’s models were really good at.

I’ve read so many stories about people claiming models getting nerfed after a new release and now it seems I can finally join them.

A specific first-hand account of how both models' planning behavior has changed.
artdigital 2026-11-02 17:236/10first_handinformative | parent | next [–]

IMO Astra isn’t really lazy, just extremely literal so when you use it side by side with gpt-6.1-sol, it might appear more lazy but it’s often just the big difference in prompting between the 2. Astra wants a clear goal definition of what you want it to do, while sol infers a bit more. And the Claude’s infer a lot lot more.

From memory, prompts like “this file is a bit messy” would trigger Sol and Claude to start editing the file immediately, while Astra wouldn’t. But if you give Astra a clear plan and a definition of what you want it to do, then it will keep working until that ask is fulfilled.

Especially compared with Claude that’s a huge difference, Claude is so proactive, I have to ESC it multiple times during the day and tell it to wait because I only asked a simple question.

IMO Astra isn’t really lazy, just extremely literal so when you use it side by side with gpt-6.1-sol, it might appear more lazy but it’s often just the big difference in prompting between the 2. Astra wants a clear goal definition of what you want it to do, while sol infers a bit more. And the Claude’s infer a lot lot more.

From memory, prompts like “this file is a bit messy” would trigger Sol and Claude to start editing the file immediately, while Astra wouldn’t. But if you give Astra a clear plan and a definition of what you want it to do, then it will keep working until that ask is fulfilled.

Especially compared with Claude that’s a huge difference, Claude is so proactive, I have to ESC it multiple times during the day and tell it to wait because I only asked a simple question.

A first-hand comparison of how literally each model reads prompts, with concrete examples.

I imagine this is basically not at all due to actual model changes.

If you use Codex, Claude Code, etc, those are being constantly updated. That sort of behavior would be highly harness dependent.

I imagine this is basically not at all due to actual model changes.

If you use Codex, Claude Code, etc, those are being constantly updated. That sort of behavior would be highly harness dependent.

Gives a plausible alternative explanation: perceived model behavior changes may come from updates to the harness.
kind_wren74 2026-11-02 18:34 | rewritten3/10insinuation | original | parent | prev [–]

My guess is models are constantly tweaked behind the scenes to adjust to available resources, steer people to other models, accommodate usage on other models, try out optimizations, etc.

Performance seems to vary like the weather.

I also suspect government agencies like the NSA may now be involved in deciding what can be offered to the public, possibly keeping their own access a step or two beyond what's public.

original comment by 01100011

My guess is models are constantly tweaked behind the scenes to adjust to available resources, steer people to other models, accommodate usage on other models, try out optimizations, etc.

Performance seems to vary like the weather.

I think you also likely have three letter agencies involved heavily now. The NSA is, without a doubt, policing what can be offered to the public and ensuring what the NSA has access to is a step or two beyond what is public.

The guess about behind-the-scenes tuning is reasonable, so it stays; the unsupported NSA claim was stated as certain and is now framed as the author's suspicion.

So how is this different from Astra, if it's the same weights and zero other training has been done?

Did they essentially package a system prompt?

So how is this different from Astra, if it's the same weights and zero other training has been done?

Did they essentially package a system prompt?

A genuine question about what sets the release apart if it uses the same weights.

> GPT-Rosalind-6 uses the same weights as GPT-6 Astra, our flagship reasoning model.

Didn’t Sol-6.1 top Astra? Or is it maybe that Astra is still a larger model and therefore can comprehend deeper complexity better in the long run?

> GPT-Rosalind-6 uses the same weights as GPT-6 Astra, our flagship reasoning model.

Didn’t Sol-6.1 top Astra? Or is it maybe that Astra is still a larger model and therefore can comprehend deeper complexity better in the long run?

A real question about the choice of base model, asked in good faith.
lnkdinsuxs 2026-11-02 16:526/10first_handinformative | parent | next [–]

> Didn’t Sol-6.1 top Astra?

On specific coding skewed benchmarks yes.

But Astra is in a different league when it comes to doing research and investigative tasks that require exploration.

For my usecases, Astra is pareto frontier - it dominates Fable 5.1 on cost. Fable 5.1 is a phenomenal model but Astra is cheaper and uses way less tokens and steps to produce similar output.

> Didn’t Sol-6.1 top Astra?

On specific coding skewed benchmarks yes.

But Astra is in a different league when it comes to doing research and investigative tasks that require exploration.

For my usecases, Astra is pareto frontier - it dominates Fable 5.1 on cost. Fable 5.1 is a phenomenal model but Astra is cheaper and uses way less tokens and steps to produce similar output.

A substantive first-hand comparison of how the models trade off on capability and cost.

[deleted]


I thought the same.

My assumption is Astra is the biggest model in terms of param size and has the most intellectual horsepower.

But Sol-6.1 is more instruction tuned to perform better on the average use cases for most users, so it benchmarks better and feels better to use.

I thought the same.

My assumption is Astra is the biggest model in terms of param size and has the most intellectual horsepower.

But Sol-6.1 is more instruction tuned to perform better on the average use cases for most users, so it benchmarks better and feels better to use.

A good-faith, speculative explanation of how the two models might differ; it's labeled as an assumption.

It's widely suspected that sol 6.1 is a slightly detuned version of astra 6

It's widely suspected that sol 6.1 is a slightly detuned version of astra 6

A short, good-faith answer to the parent's question about how Sol-6.1 relates to Astra, though it gives no source for the claim.

> It's widely suspected that sol 6.1 is a slightly detuned version of astra 6

My feel is it's the opposite of a "detune".

Sol 6.1 is likely a distillation that's highly instruction tuned and designed to perform better on benchmarks.

> It's widely suspected that sol 6.1 is a slightly detuned version of astra 6

My feel is it's the opposite of a "detune".

Sol 6.1 is likely a distillation that's highly instruction tuned and designed to perform better on benchmarks.

Gives a substantive alternative view of how Sol 6.1 relates to Astra 6.

Sol 6.1 is incredibly incredibly slow, 20t/s slow (vs the ~70-80 of Terra 6.1 and Luna 6). It wouldn't be so much slower if it was just a distillation, surely? There's something else going on there.

Sol 6.1 is incredibly incredibly slow, 20t/s slow (vs the ~70-80 of Terra 6.1 and Luna 6). It wouldn't be so much slower if it was just a distillation, surely? There's something else going on there.

Gives concrete throughput numbers and a reasoned objection to the distillation theory.

There was some (admittedly flimsy) evidence from a microsoft model description card that it's doing multiple passes through its own weights before token generation to improve output; it might be an architecture change that's making it slow, moreso than raw size

There was some (admittedly flimsy) evidence from a microsoft model description card that it's doing multiple passes through its own weights before token generation to improve output; it might be an architecture change that's making it slow, moreso than raw size

A useful, carefully hedged explanation for the slow speed, and it says where the evidence comes from.

> Sol 6.1 is incredibly incredibly slow, 20t/s slow

How are you getting these numbers?

> Sol 6.1 is incredibly incredibly slow, 20t/s slow

How are you getting these numbers?

A sincere question about how the parent measured the speed it cited.

I have a small token/s extension for Pi. It's regularly around ~15-20t/s for Sol 6.1.

I have a small token/s extension for Pi. It's regularly around ~15-20t/s for Sol 6.1.

Gives a direct, first-hand answer about how the throughput numbers were measured.

But is it slower than Astra?

But is it slower than Astra?

A brief but real question comparing Sol 6.1's speed with another model.

[deleted]
quick_osprey38 2026-11-02 16:45 | rewritten2/10low_effortcurmudgeonly | original | prev | next [–]

OpenAI's naming scheme is hard to follow. I get that naming is hard, but I'd like it to at least be consistent.

original comment by kingjimmy

OpenAI naming scheme makes no sense. I get naming is hard but atleast keep it consistent.

A minor complaint about naming; the tone is softened and the point is kept.

I felt like I had a read on it right away – it's a 6[.0]-series model, and not named after space since it's specialist model, and I assumed it was named after Rosalind Franklin. Looks like the docs back that up, that it's based on Astra, which is not [yet?] at 6.1.

I felt like I had a read on it right away – it's a 6[.0]-series model, and not named after space since it's specialist model, and I assumed it was named after Rosalind Franklin. Looks like the docs back that up, that it's based on Astra, which is not [yet?] at 6.1.

Answers the naming complaint with good-faith reasoning that the docs back up.

As a new Claude user, I find Anthropic's naming confusing too. I choose between Fable, Opus, Sonnet, and Haiku, and the effort levels are medium, extra, max, and high, which don't have an obvious order.

original comment by emil-lp

I'm a new Claude user. I get to choose between Fable, Opus, Sonnet, and Haiku. Effort medium, extra, max, high.

Makes sense.

Took out the sarcasm but kept the real comparison showing that a competitor's naming is just as confusing.

Also why are cards hundreds of pages long? Seems like a broken metaphor.

Also why are cards hundreds of pages long? Seems like a broken metaphor.

A light but real observation that calling hundreds-of-page documents 'cards' stretches the metaphor, which fits the parent's point about naming.

Honestly the names of most of the frontier models are just getting more and more confusing. Maybe this one gets a pass for being a specialist model for bio. But it's hard to decide which model to use at this point, especially OpenAI.

Honestly the names of most of the frontier models are just getting more and more confusing. Maybe this one gets a pass for being a specialist model for bio. But it's hard to decide which model to use at this point, especially OpenAI.

A fair, mild remark on confusing model naming, and it allows that this one is a bio specialist model.
varispeed 2026-11-02 16:51 | removed0/10jokelow_effort | parent | prev [–]

Probably AI came up with the naming scheme ;-P Maybe they used Gemini for that or copilot.

Probably AI came up with the naming scheme ;-P Maybe they used Gemini for that or copilot.

A joke about AI picking the names, with no real point to keep.
xyzsparetimexyz 2026-11-02 18:42 | removed0/10jokelow_effort | prev | next [–]

Named after planet 6 in the Rosalind system right?

Named after planet 6 in the Rosalind system right?

A one-line joke about the name with nothing else in it.
modest_koala28 2026-11-02 16:29 | rewritten2/10ideologicaloff_topic | original | prev | next [–]

My view is that open-source models will win out in the end: demand for AI is everywhere, and I don't think people outside the U.S. can count on depending on U.S. corporations or the U.S. government anymore.

original comment by theplumber

It’s clear to me that open source will rule at the end of the day as everyone wants AI and nobody can rely on U.S crop/gov anymore.

A sweeping claim that doesn't engage with the system card, rewritten as the author's opinion with the reasoning they gave.

And who's going to be providing these models?

How is open source going to work when governments start declaring models as munitions?

There are a lot of unanswered questions the open communities are going to have to deal with.

And who's going to be providing these models?

How is open source going to work when governments start declaring models as munitions?

There are a lot of unanswered questions the open communities are going to have to deal with.

Disagrees in good faith and raises real open questions about who funds open models and what happens if governments classify models as munitions.

They could be crowdfunded. You could even have a system where only contributors to the crowdfund have a license to use it.

>How is open source going to work when governments start declaring models as munitions?

I mean open source cryptography did win that battle in the end. Even if it's illegal you could host the model weights on i2psnark and crowdfund with monero.

They could be crowdfunded. You could even have a system where only contributors to the crowdfund have a license to use it.

>How is open source going to work when governments start declaring models as munitions?

I mean open source cryptography did win that battle in the end. Even if it's illegal you could host the model weights on i2psnark and crowdfund with monero.

Gives a substantive answer to the parent: it proposes crowdfunding and points to the crypto wars as a precedent.

that's if few currently funded by someone open labs will continue being funded without receiving huge chunk of revenue from their models use.

that's if few currently funded by someone open labs will continue being funded without receiving huge chunk of revenue from their models use.

A fair, good-faith objection: open labs may struggle to stay funded if they don't capture revenue from their models.
hmokiguess 2026-11-02 16:19 | removed0/10low_effortthread_removed | prev | next [–]

A bare, unexplained video link can't be rewritten without making up its point, and the only reply is a bare Wikipedia link that adds little on its own.
DetroitThrow 2026-11-02 16:34 | removed0/10low_effortinformative | parent [–]

steady_ocelot80 2026-11-02 17:04 | rewritten4/10ideological | original | prev | next [–]

> We review applicants’ proposed uses, security controls and governance practices before granting access.

I don't think for-profit corporations should be the ones deciding who gets access to a capability like this. Gatekeeping power of that kind should be democratically accountable, not left to a company's internal review.

original comment by zb3

> We review applicants’ proposed uses, security controls and governance practices before granting access.

For-profit corporations shouldn't have this power, this is not democracy.

This is a real objection to corporate gatekeeping, stated as a sweeping slogan. The rewrite spells out the position without changing it.
clever_beaver74 2026-11-02 17:57 | rewritten4/10ideological | original | parent | next [–]

Corporations are not, and never have been, democracies.

What you're really asking for is regulation, but in my view regulations have tended to give the government and incumbent corporations more control, not less.

I think the more effective lever is electing better leaders who aren't captured by the businesses they're supposed to regulate.

original comment by pixl97

Corporations are not, nor ever have been a democracy.

What you are asking for is regulations, but as we have seen regulations are pointed at giving the government and corporations more control.

Maybe elect better leaders and not corrupt old businessmen.

A real argument about regulation and regulatory capture; rewritten to drop the 'corrupt old businessmen' swipe and present the sweeping claim as the author's view.

I want one regulation on AI: everything must be public. Training data, code, procedures, everything. And for that to work, a complete scrapping and overhaul of our copyright system. One can dream.

I want one regulation on AI: everything must be public. Training data, code, procedures, everything. And for that to work, a complete scrapping and overhaul of our copyright system. One can dream.

A sincere policy position, full transparency for AI plus copyright reform, that responds directly to the parent's point about regulation.

This is because of the democratically elected government demanding these controls. Remember Fable?

This is because of the democratically elected government demanding these controls. Remember Fable?

A short, good-faith counterpoint: it says the access controls come from government requirements rather than corporate choice, and cites a precedent.

No it's bog standard capitalism. If you want to buy something from somebody else, they (usually) have the right to refuse.

No it's bog standard capitalism. If you want to buy something from somebody else, they (usually) have the right to refuse.

A blunt but substantive disagreement that frames access control as an ordinary seller's right to refuse.
opal_finch87 2026-11-02 16:45 | rewritten5/10snarkideologicalfirst_hand | original | prev | next [–]

Last I checked, machine learning wasn't the bottleneck for drug discovery, and where it fits in the research process was largely worked out 5+ years ago. Weren't there already a lot of ML-based drug discovery startups that went out of business or got acquired? As I understand it, that wasn't because they weren't useful but because they produced more candidates than the industry could use.

I'm wary of researchers offloading their thinking to a specialty model after seeing what it's done to me and my colleagues in software. It hasn't made anyone more competent. Mostly it lets people do less novel, lower-quality work faster.

My view is that OpenAI and Anthropic building these platforms is mostly about creating a narrative that AI will lead to cures for disease. I don't think it will, but a lot of the public now assumes it will cure cancer, and some tech leaders seem convinced language models will help them live forever. Promises of a fountain of youth have a long history of being oversold.

original comment by lifeisloving

Last I checked machine learning wasnt the bottleneck for drug discovery and where it fits in the research process was largely solved 5+ years ago.. Weren't there already a ton of ML based drug discovery startups that went out of business, or got aquired, not because they werent useful but because they produced more candidates than the industry could use.

I dont think I want researchers offloading their thinking to some specialty model after seeing what its done to me and my colleagues in software, it certainly isn't making anyone more competent.

It really only enables people to be able to do less novel and lower quality work faster.

OpenAI and Anthropic creating these platforms seems mostly just to create narratives around AI that its going to lead to cures for disease, which it wont, but plenty of normies assume it will cure cancer now. Also a bunch tech oligarchs who are equally convinced or 'one-shot' they're going to live forever because of language models lol.

Promises of the Fountain of Youth continue to be a time tested tools for snake oil salesmen.

The points about the drug-discovery bottleneck and the commenter's own software experience are real, so I kept them and removed the 'normies', 'oligarchs' and snake-oil jabs.

When did you check and what did you find?

For me its not a solved problem and AI/ML would still help to solve plenty Drugdiscovery in itself is such a broad area

There are still normal labs out there doing research for years on one drug alone

And biology of humans is huge and complex, not only is it not solved, its also expensive.

Even if you just not do ML drug discovery, AI can hellp with making the research faster: writing grants, finding issues, creating plans/ideas/suggestions, hepling with finding the newest research, writing code for supporting or analysis, controling microscopes and machines.

When did you check and what did you find?

For me its not a solved problem and AI/ML would still help to solve plenty Drugdiscovery in itself is such a broad area

There are still normal labs out there doing research for years on one drug alone

And biology of humans is huge and complex, not only is it not solved, its also expensive.

Even if you just not do ML drug discovery, AI can hellp with making the research faster: writing grants, finding issues, creating plans/ideas/suggestions, hepling with finding the newest research, writing code for supporting or analysis, controling microscopes and machines.

Good-faith disagreement that gives concrete ways AI can help research beyond candidate generation.
opal_finch87 2026-11-02 18:18 | rewritten5/10snarkideological | original | root | parent [–]

I think this is overly optimistic.

Bioinformatics researchers doing ML work already use LLMs where they're helpful; they don't need a specialized model. I'd bet heavily that this model won't still be getting updates a year from now.

I don't believe LLMs will help with drug discovery more than existing ML approaches do, and I don't think many biotech/bioinformatics PhDs would agree that they will. They're language models. Nobody is saying researchers won't use LLMs for the tedious parts, but that doesn't speed up the fundamental bottleneck, which is clinical studies. We already have backlogs of good drug candidates, and LLMs won't let anyone run more clinical trials.

This work happens in the real world under real constraints. There's no terminal, no compiler, no proofs, and it takes a lot of money. Not everything can be solved by computation.

original comment by lifeisloving

This is just futurism tech bro optimism.

Researchers in bioinfomatics that are doing the ML work are already using llms where its helpful, they dont need a specialized model. I'll bet my entire net worth and future lifetime earnings that this model will not continue to get updates a year from now.

This idea that LLMs are going to be able to help with drug discovery better than existing ML approaches is a just a lie, I dont think there's a single biotech/bioinfomatics PhD who agrees with you.

They are language models!!! Nobody said researchers wont leverage llms to do the boring stuff, but that doesnt speed up the fundamental bottleneck which are clinical studies. We already have great drug candidates, backlogs of them and having llms is not going to enable you to suddenly be able to do more clinical trials!!!

These things happen in the real world, with real constraints There is no terminal, there is no compiler, there are no proofs, money is required (loads of it).

Regardless of what Trump says, everything is not computer.

The real argument that clinical trials, not candidate generation, are the bottleneck is kept, and the dismissive framing and political jab are removed.

I'd push back on 'they're just language models'. In my view these models have already solved a millennium problem. Drug discovery also involves a lot of physics, not just language.

You mentioned ML yourself, too. The LLM boom means ML as a whole gets more funding, and ML infrastructure has become easier to get, cheaper and faster.

I also think bigger and better LLMs can help directly. Just for finding better or more optimized experiments, there's value in a model that has all the current research in context.

original comment by origini

Ah yes the 'language models!!!' which still solved a milenium problem.

Drugdiscovery has also a lot of physics involved btw

And you said ML yourself. You do understand, that the current LLM explositon also means that ML in itself gets more funding and now infrastructure for ML itself got easier to get, cheaper and faster right?

And yes for sure bigger and better LLMs can help: Alone for finding potential better or more optimized experiments, there is value in an LLM having all the current research in context.

Removed the sarcasm and condescending framing but kept the counterarguments about ML funding, physics, and having the literature in context.
sunny_stoat35 2026-11-02 16:55 | rewritten2/10low_effortsnark | original | prev | next [–]

I wouldn't trust an OpenAI product with any proprietary data.

original comment by chairhairair

You’d be a fool to use an OpenAI product with any proprietary data.

Removed the insult but kept the commenter's data-privacy concern, which has no supporting reasoning.
vindex10 2026-11-02 17:013/10questionlow_effort | parent [–]

can you elaborate?

can you elaborate?

A short, sincere request asking the parent to back up a sweeping claim.

maybe a reference to the math's researcher who was using openai tooling, and then they released a new discovery very similar to his research?

maybe a reference to the math's researcher who was using openai tooling, and then they released a new discovery very similar to his research?

A tentative, good-faith answer to a request for clarification; it adds a little context, though it gives no specifics or source.
ivory_magpie23 2026-11-02 17:27 | rewritten3/10ideologicalpersonal_attackinsinuationbad_faith | original | prev [–]

Terms like "dual use" and "Preparedness Framework" come from military vocabulary. My view is that the focus on extinction-level risks pulls press and public attention away from the more immediate effect these models are built to have: putting mathematicians and white-collar workers out of work.

original comment by 124-asf

Great military terms: "dual use", "Preparedness Framework", etc.

You just want to make all mathematicians and white collar employees unemployed and want to distract the press and the public with your extinction nonsense.

Though you may care about bioweapons because they could affect you and your trafficked children.

Kept the critique of military-style safety language and of extinction talk as a distraction from job loss; removed the vile insinuation about trafficked children.



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